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Webinars

Date Topics  
7/09 Creating stunning jewelry designs with T-Splines View
5/07 How to approach modeling with T-Splines View
3/07 Carl Bass reintroduces T-Splines for Rhino View
6/21 Transitioning from NURBS to T-Splines View
12/07 Footwear modeling with T-Splines 3.3 for Rhino View
11/29 New T-Splines reverse engineering tools View
10/28 How T-Splines changed my aproach to making jewelry in CAD View
09/29 Modeling a water gun View
09/07 Car modeling:
Parts 1, 2, & 3
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07/06 tsElements intro
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06/22 Free-form Architecture View
06/15 TS Pipe command View
06/08 T-Splines for Rhino intro View

New tsPipe advanced features video

A support and feedback forum for Autodesk T-Splines Plug-in for Rhino users.

New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby Matt Sederberg » Fri Mar 04, 2011 1:58 pm

Tom Finnigan dives deeper into the new tsPipe command, available in T-Splines v3 beta for Rhino. This is pretty powerful. You might need to watch this video a few times to catch everything. Please let us know if you have any questions.

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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby Holger Jahns » Sat Mar 05, 2011 4:14 am

Interesting concept Tom!
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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby MerelyMyself » Mon Mar 07, 2011 4:27 pm

Hey there,

I've been trying to create a new joint set all morning and I can't seem to get it to work. Every time I go to apply my new joint set to a tsPiped object, I get an error message reading: "The T-Splines command has crashed. You should save your file immediately and restart Rhino."

Any insights about what might be going wrong? Does it maybe have something to do with the joint prototypes I created? They're just T-spline meshes with some points, right?
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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby TomFinnigan » Mon Mar 07, 2011 5:01 pm

There's a good chance that there are still bugs in the custom joints. If you want to send me a 3dm file or a jing video that would be very helpful.. :)
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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby MerelyMyself » Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:19 am

Ok, so here is my sample file. And here are the steps I've been taking:

Select six intersecting curves, run tsPipe
Adjust radius to .5
Joints > AddJointSet > "Hex"
Check to ensure that CurrJointSet=Hex
Joints > ImportJointSet > select end cap and hexagonal prototype
Joints > CurrJointSet > Hex

"The T-Splines command has crashed. You should save your file immediately and restart Rhino."

I'm running this on the T-Splines 3 beta (64 bit) and Rhino 5 beta (64 bit) from 3/1/11.

It seems straightforward enough that I'm having trouble telling what's going wrong.
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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby aubergine2001 » Wed Mar 09, 2011 7:49 am

Thanks for the video. I have just started using v3 and the new pipe tool will help me a lot. I was wondering about turning the pipe into itself, like a shell nautilus / Fibonacci / Golden Spiral. I will be doing a few of these and was wondering how to make my pipe work. I have attached my file as V4 though I am working in 32bit V5 Rhino with T-Splines v3r7034

Adding more segments helps, but the end segments do not adjust size. And therein lies the problem. Any ideas on changing end segments in the pipe command, as opposed to edges, verts or faces?

Best Regards … Randy
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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby MerelyMyself » Fri Mar 18, 2011 1:24 pm

No word on how to get around this problem yet? Is it just a bug that needs to get worked out, or was I doing something legitimately wrong in my set up?
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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby Nicholas North » Fri Mar 18, 2011 2:25 pm

MerelyMyself,

Sorry about being slow the respond. We've been pretty swamped trying to get Beta 2 out and we never had time to look at this closely enough to give a good response.

But now we've looked. At first glance, your joint looks like it should have worked. However, something fails when it tries to use the joint. We don't know exactly what yet, but we'll look more closely and get it fixed.

Thanks for the report.

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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby MerelyMyself » Fri Mar 18, 2011 2:31 pm

That's understandable. I'm not in a huge rush, but I do have some plans in place for tsPipe once I can get these advanced features to work.

I look forward to figuring this out!
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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby MerelyMyself » Tue Apr 19, 2011 5:42 pm

So has there been any progress on the Joint set creation front? This is still something I'd love to utilise more -- if I can get it to work.

I've been trying again in the new V3 plugin, and I still can't accomplish what I was trying to do much earlier in this thread. The plugin still crashes if I try that old file/workflow I posted last month. In a new file, however, I can go through a similar process (though this time I just tried for 5 radial lines instead of 6) without crashing, but I still don't get the desired result.

I should note that I can go through exactly the same sort of joint creation that's shown in the video here without any issues. It's just that the kind of joints I actually want to make (planar, radial intersections of more than 4 curves) don't work the way I know they can.

Another thing of note: I've noticed that the bendy joint set provided in the plugin will accomplish the desired result on sets of radial lines from 5-10 as long as DeformJoints=No. I inspected the exported joint set from Bendy but that just confuses me more. Square, Open, Bendy, and the video's Fancy set all make pretty obvious visual sense, but there is no pentagonal, hexagonal, septagonal, octagonal, nonagonal, or decagonal joint in the Bendy set. So how is it managing to join them so nicely?

In conclusion: I'm very interested in the joint set creation option in tsPipe, but I need a more thorough outlining of how to get it to work right. Help, please?
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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby Nicholas North » Wed Apr 20, 2011 4:31 pm

I've bumped the right people on this. Hopefully we can get you an answer soon.

MerelyMyself wrote: Square, Open, Bendy, and the video's Fancy set all make pretty obvious visual sense, but there is no pentagonal, hexagonal, septagonal, octagonal, nonagonal, or decagonal joint in the Bendy set. So how is it managing to join them so nicely?

The answer to this is that tsPipe is able to automatically generate joints for you when you don't have a prototype available with the right number of connections. However, these joints are simple, so they may not always be ideal. At least it works, right? :)

Basically you get a thickened n-gon. So, for example, if you have eight curves meeting you get a joint with an octagon on top and bottom, and eight quads around the perimeter connecting the octagons together.

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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby MerelyMyself » Wed Apr 20, 2011 5:47 pm

Ok, this is starting to make more sense now.

I see that all the joint sets (not just Bendy) will generate appropriate joints for n-gon connections. This is pretty cool. But let's say that I wanted to create a model that mostly took advantage of the Square joint set, but also had a pentagonal joint in there somewhere. What then?

If I use regular old Square for this situation, it doesn't auto-generate a pentagonal joint because (I am guessing) it already has a joint in its set for five intersecting lines, and it tries to use that instead of generating a new one. This is fine if all of your curves intersect at 90 degree angles, but if it's five planar, radial curves, it gets all funky and deformed.

So naturally, I tried to create a new joint set that was just Square plus a pentagonal joint. That should fill in the gap here, right?

Well, sort of. If I create five totally planar, radial curves and try to use my new joint set on it (I call it Penta) it still wants to use the cube joint with five intersections.

BUT if I make it the slightest bit non-planar it'll happily use my pentagonal joint. Why is this?

Also worth noting: If I export my new Penta joint set to check on it, it's replaced my nice, neat, pentagonal prism joint with one that is mostly like it, only the pentagonal faces have been replaced with three triangles. Why is this? Sure, I can go in and delete those extra edges later, but I'd rather not have to if I can help it. And I know tsPipe can create a true pentagonal joint because that's what it generates if I use Bendy instead.

I have attached a sample file to show what I'm talking about.
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tsPipeTest2.3dm
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Last edited by MerelyMyself on Fri Apr 22, 2011 11:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby MerelyMyself » Fri Apr 22, 2011 11:13 am

Any ideas?
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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby TomFinnigan » Tue Apr 26, 2011 4:53 pm

MerelyMyself wrote:Any ideas?


Sorry I took so long to reply to this.. :oops:

It looks like you've found several bugs in the custom joints. The first is that it's not properly handling n-gons in the prototypes, which is what's converting the pentagon into 3 triangles - you'd get the same thing if you converted it to a Rhino mesh.

The joints you mentioned that are automatically generated for high-valence cases where there are no prototypes are called autojoints. For an n-sided joint, it uses a thickened n-gon. This works okay for joints that are planar, but is sometimes not desirable. (As an aside, we based this on the case of the top of a sphere, where lots of isocurves meet but are planar. We also have ideas for handling what we call the 'koosh ball' case, but those didn't make it into the implementation yet).

The default behavior for autojoints is that they are considered when there are no joints of that valence in the joint set. You can change this behavior in the Joint options submenu, set AlwaysIncludeAutojoint=Yes. For some reason, the autojoint seems to behave better than the same thing as a normal part of the jointset - specifically, when aligning the joint to the curves, it looks like we're getting exactly the wrong orientation.

Thanks for reporting these bugs.. I'll get them fixed. In the meantime, try the AlwaysIncludeAutojoint and see if that gives you better results..

Again, sorry it took me so long to dig into your great bug report.
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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby MerelyMyself » Wed Apr 27, 2011 11:49 am

No need to worry about the wait; if I seem impatient it's just because I'm using tsPipe pretty much every day (thus all these bug reports/questions), so the more I understand of its mysteries, the more magic I can do with it. :P

But thanks for this info; I'll definitely poke around the autojoint options.

Here's something that I'd like confirmed: When creating custom joints, whatever faces are meant to be attached to the pipes must be square, yes? No 3 or 5+ connecting faces?
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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby Nicholas North » Wed Apr 27, 2011 12:48 pm

MerelyMyself wrote:Here's something that I'd like confirmed: When creating custom joints, whatever faces are meant to be attached to the pipes must be square, yes? No 3 or 5+ connecting faces?

That is correct: faces attached to the pipes must be four-sided.

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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby jacek.jaskolski » Wed Feb 15, 2012 12:39 pm

Hi All,

First of all thanks for creating and developing this great plugin! Also let me say that the community around here, people sharing their great projects, workflows and knowledge, is really impressive.

--

I have been playing around with the tsPipe tool for a while and was very excited to discovered the custom joint set option. Unfortunatelly I keep getting errors in my models.

I started off with a very basic example with just two simple prototypes (img1) but no matter what I do the joint always gets rotated (as if the curves were twisted).

This is very strange behaviour. I also reproduced it with copies of the standard sets (img2), using the following steps:
1. tsPipe > joints > square > export
2. move the joint in Rhino to another location
3. tsPipe > joints > add joint set > import

If I move back the geometry to where it was originally exported, it sometimes works and sometimes it doesn't...

Is this a bug or am I doing something wrong?
I've attached the 3dm file. I'm using Rhino 4.0 SR9 / T-splines 3.2 r7656.

Best regards,
Jacek

tsPipe custom joint sets errors.3dm
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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby sassas1209 » Sun Dec 22, 2013 1:21 am

I want to know how to create a new joint for tspipe (ts pipe add new joint command)
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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby Nicholas North » Mon Dec 23, 2013 11:52 am

This is explained in the video at the top of this thread. Custom joints are discussed starting at 4:00. Importing your own is discussed starting at 5:25.

The basic idea is that you create a mesh representing each joint. You put a point at the joint center and a point at the center of each connection face, as shown in the video. Please note, connection faces *must* be quads. Other faces can be n-gons, but connection faces cannot be anything other than 4-sided.

The video explains the rest, really. But if you have specific questions about the process that are not addressed in the video then please ask them.

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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby byclo » Fri Mar 14, 2014 2:03 pm

I have found a solution for the issue creating joints. To avoid the "The T-Splines command has crashed. You should save your file immediately and restart Rhino." message, the meshes that you input must be welded. You can check for this by exploding the mesh. A welded mesh will not explode into individual faces.

An east way to achieve this is to model your joints in nerbs, join each into a poly-surface and then run it through grasshopper's "SMesh" and "Weld" components (see image).
Image
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Re: New tsPipe advanced features video

Postby Nicholas North » Fri Mar 14, 2014 4:04 pm

Thank you byclo. That is very helpful information.

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